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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Grand illusion » » What do you think of this illusion idea... (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

plainman007
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Now we all know of black art. Fine. What if we further used the picket fence principle or rather slatted gate. Which is in other words a huge frame with slat like openings to the back drop. Now this kind of slatted thing on either side of an illusion can provide some thing like a secret tunnel into the wings. Im trying to use some technically complicated words here so as to not expose things to lurkers. Wont this slatted system coupled with black lights from the front help camoflauge black art assistants more easily ??. I think it would, than have the stage bare, which might give telltale glints even with black assistants. How about taking this further and having metal fenced frames. Something like those high tech transformer plants/factories. Or prison fence kinds. White or aluminium painted to glow under Black Lighting. Wont they diffuse the view to the backdrop even more. While still allowing unrestricted view to the back. The thing is when the main lights come on, these things are almost completely transparent. So they are very unsuspective in appearance. But yet form a nice gauze to help black art movement behind it. But this principle might look dumb for outright black art manifestations. Such as making someone disappear etc. The audience might think why do it behind the fence ?. But for indirect black art its real good. (where black art is used to achieve a certain effect or aid an illusion- but not very overtly). Like theres a big white cloth box on stage. The wire fences only on the sides as part of set. Motorcycle gets into the case from behind the fences. This proves no trickery and the fact that they are see thru. Then its whisked away from box thru otherside of white box. Thru black art behind fence. I think it would be much easier for the black art to work since it is happening behind the fence. The fence kinda breaks the overt clarity element. Let me know what you guys feel about this idea. Thanks.
varg
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It´s a great functional idea-
I´ve been working with " O.pashra " styled B.A.
and B.A . morphed in to different illusions for ex:
classic B.A table...
I tried a variation of the setup you are talking about
I produced a 8 man dance troup - finding out that metal
shining was enough to " break up " the B.A that was involved
without giving away that I used B.A.
Uv colour would have brighten up the scenery to much -
In a lot of cases I think your thinking would do a lot for ex:
bigger loads like a car...
I think one of the major problems would be the setuptime for
this.
TricksDaniel
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I have to agree that the set-up would take a little longer but it's a great idea especially for something bigger. Were you planning on using regular lighting or using lighting just for black art? If you had the stage set right and were using lighting for black art you wouldn't need the fence. But, it would allow you to do some bigger effects. Some might disagree but I think if you have the money, go for it. If it doesn't work out learn from your mistake. But if it does, you'll be one of the unique one's performing it. This means more jobs because you can offer clients something more that others don't have. Think big.
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LeeAlex2002
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This principle has already been used more than once, and is currently being used somewhere, but I cannot say here to protect the innocent.
Yours Magically,
Lee Alex

http://www.magic2wear.com
Dr.Maya Baalaamurugaan
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I used the exact same principal as plainman for a car ashrah ............
plainman007
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Leealex : "Cannot say here to protect the innocent."

Does the "innocent" mean ME.

And what does the term INNOCENT mean in this context ?

If someone here is innocent. Is there someone whos a crook ? Or do you intend to say that indirectly. You have said very clearly that its a principle. don't you agree that principles are free from copyright. You cant say someones using black art so we shouldnt. Mine was an orginal idea which I had on my own. Not copied. And its an age old priciple. So many performers are using it currently. So whos the culprit and whos innocent ?. Even if someone else hears my idea and uses it. Or part of it. They are not stealing. Its a free idea. I will probably inspire some to try it. Some may have a better idea than mine which I very well understand and encourage. don't you think so ?
LeeAlex2002
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Quote:
On 2004-10-11 12:50, plainman007 wrote:
Leealex : "Cannot say here to protect the innocent."

Does the "innocent" mean ME.

And what does the term INNOCENT mean in this context ?

If someone here is innocent. Is there someone who's a crook ? Or do you intend to say that indirectly. You have said very clearly that its a principle. don't you agree that principles are free from copyright. You cant say someones using black art so we shouldn't. Mine was an original idea which I had on my own. Not copied. And its an age old principle. So many performers are using it currently. So who's the culprit and who's innocent ?. Even if someone else hears my idea and uses it. Or part of it. They are not stealing. Its a free idea. I will probably inspire some to try it. Some may have a better idea than mine which I very well understand and encourage. don't you think so ?


Calm down!

"To protect the innocent" is just a coin phrase and is not pointed at anyone in particular including you.

Nobody who uses this principle is, as far as I am concerned considered either innocent or guilty.
Yours Magically,
Lee Alex

http://www.magic2wear.com
magicmanrob
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We currently use a form of this in a routine that 2 years ago named my son SAM junior stage champion. I would suggest you get Ralph Adams book and it might enlighten you to the technique you are talking about. Its no secret but few utilize it like we did and it took no special lighting and just the general lights available in most venues. Besides you wouldnt want to use any black light as anthing even white lint on the assistants would radiate right out to the audiance
The Mirror Images
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I think it is a neat copncept.

Hey guys here is the meaning of innocent:

# Uncorrupted by evil, malice, or wrongdoing; sinless: an innocent child.
#

1. Not guilty of a specific crime or offense; legally blameless: was innocent of all charges.
2. Within, allowed by, or sanctioned by the law; lawful.

#

1. Not dangerous or harmful; innocuous: an innocent prank.
2. Candid; straightforward: a child's innocent stare.

#

1. Not experienced or worldly; naive.
2. Betraying or suggesting no deception or guile; artless.

#

1. Not exposed to or familiar with something specified; ignorant: American tourists wholly innocent of French.
2. Unaware


Just a joke guys. Cheers all

Michael
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Bokken
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I'm thinking LeeAlex2002 meant innocent as a "tongue in cheek" comment intended to relate that he didn't want to point out the wizard behind the curtain to non-magicians about the method behind the performer in questions magic routine Smile
LeeAlex2002
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Quote:
On 2004-10-13 18:08, Bokken wrote:
I'm thinking LeeAlex2002 meant innocent as a "tongue in cheek" comment intended to relate that he didn't want to point out the wizard behind the curtain to non-magicians about the method behind the performer in questions magic routine Smile


Precisely!
Ufff! Finally someone on my wavelength!
Cheers!
Yours Magically,
Lee Alex

http://www.magic2wear.com
John T. Sheets
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I have seen this type of thing done. If I remember correctly, Copperfeild, & Henning.
www.johnTsheets.com

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plainman007
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Micheal....HELP !....is this statement really a brain twister(like an illusion) or is it my language skills that are lacking ? Can you plz explain what this means Micheal. Since I'm from a different country, maybe I'm unable to grasp the sentence construction here.

"meant innocent as a "tongue in cheek" comment intended to relate that he didn't want to point out the wizard behind the curtain to non-magicians about the method behind the performer in questions magic routine"

It sounds like........ the ghost behind the woofer didn't fit in because the fish were on a hike in the toaster which started the problem of the doctor who agrees that the fish aren't fish at all.
JohnDoh
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Don't worry, its no riddle, just a bunch of commonplace phrases that aren't literal. I'm no english teacher, but the person who wrote the following definition was.

"Tongue in cheek" means to speak ironically, exaggerating in a facetious manner. It refers to the (apparently now long-gone) mannerism where when a person said something ridiculous (in response to a stupid question or something like it) and then stuck his tongue into his cheek (making a visible lump in the cheek) to show that he was being facetious (or maybe to bite his tongue a bit to keep from laughing)."

"the wizard behind the curtain" is an allusion to the Wizard of Oz, in a scene where the technology behind a large illusion, if you will, was revealed when the operator was discovered behind a curtain. He basically means that he doesn't want to reveal the originator of the effect in question because he doesn't want to ruin it for people who don't know better.

So, put more simply,

LeeAlex2002 was speaking somewhat jokingly when he used the phrase "innocent," and he simply didn't want to reveal too much to the casual lurker.
LeeAlex2002
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Quote:
LeeAlex2002 was speaking somewhat jokingly when he used the phrase "innocent," and he simply didn't want to reveal too much to the casual lurker.


Precisely - I didn't want to openly reveal the names of the performers who actually use this method, in order to protect them and their property.
Yours Magically,
Lee Alex

http://www.magic2wear.com
plainman007
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But this is my own idea. Honestly. Has this idea been copyrighted anywhere. If its not then its not anyones idea. It's as much my property to use as it is theirs. Its like saying because some performer in the past used palming we shouldn't. If that's the way it's gotta be then almost all of what we are doing will have to be dropped at once because someone else has done it. There are no rights over ideas, theories, systems, methods (except for certain rare cases). Principles are free for everyone to use. If this has been patented please give me the patent number. And I will not implement it, even though it was my own idea.
Dondrake
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The concept is good, but over-complicated. If there is one thing I've learned working with illusions for the last 50 years or so, is KEEP IT SIMPLE! The more bells and whistles that you tack on, the more complicated it gets. Let's take a look at this picket fence idea:
The concept of the black art picket fence is ths slight movement from side to side to create a b/a tunnel where none existed before. I can give you a simpler way, instead of the fence, you could use overlaping b/a partitions. Then it becomes simpler because ther's no movement involved and also it reamins stationary and you can walk in and out of the illusion, no matter what props you put in front of it. (Don't forget the black floor piece. SEE THE WHITE CARD TABLE ACT in my new book (check the website) and you will find a perfect example of this. One other comment, and that is don't use black light from the downstage side (front) unless you want the white's to stand out garishly! I recommend about 4 150 watt, blue gels, surrounding the background, and aimed lighting in the front (avoid direct light). This example of overlapping the velvet allows you to ditch the picket fence idea. In Darwin's book Inexpensive Illusions he shows us a better picket fence, this one only shows up when you want it to <grin>. I do like your ideas, but keep them simple. The simpler the illusion, the better it works. DONDRAKE
(Pardon my spelling but it's hard to type with arthritis. DD)








t
Yours in Black Art Magic, DONDRAKE
"Remember, be a MAGICIAN, don't just do tricks!" Alwyn Stevenson, 1960 (RIP)
Bokken
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Haha...sorry. I didn't mean to make the phrase quite as complicated as it came out. It wasn't exactly a properly built phrase anyway Smile

Thanks for putting it a lot more simply for me JohnDoh Smile

Dave
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