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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The side walk shuffle » » Linking Rings on the street (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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BroDavid
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The issue of whether or not specs understand how an effect is done or not, is not a real issue. I don't care if they handle a TT better than I do, they still aren't going to see it. And the reality is that the TT is just a tool in a larger more entrtaining effect.

And this goes for rings, etc, etc. You have to immerse the gimmick into a much larger scheme of entertainment. It is just a tool. Like a trap door on a stage. If there is no story, and some one walks over and steps into it. Everyone will say, or at least think; trap door. But throw a story line around, a wizard with magic spell, a puff of smoke, and that person is gone and nobody sits there there thinking; trap door.

The gimmick is simply used to move the effect on the wings of a larger story. So by the time the whole effect is over, the tool is long forgotten, or never even considered because it's use was just a vehcile to something more, hopefully - much more.

I can't tell you the looks on the faces of thirty magicians, when Jim Cellini vanished a little yellow silk into a TT, (his thumb never went into the top of his fist) and then in another moment he brought it back in his other hand, and THEN pushed it back into his fist and changed it a red silk. All using a TT and still keeping the magicians on the edge of their seats as what he did was different, and entertaining.

Buit it isn't about TT's. It is about doing more than just doing a trick with a gimmick. It is about separating them where they are, to take them to a place of joy, and amazement.

BroDavid
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Zack
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I'm with Ron on this one. There will always be those who THINK they know how its done. You could vanish a 9" silk with a pull, and they'd STILL be wiggling their thumbs at you.

Werner, its true that it is POSSIBLE to show your thumbs at all times, but then you're not doing the thumb tip are you? You're doing a dye tube. The fact is the TT is more impressive (if they don't know how its done) without all the wishy washy aquitment techniques.

That being said, I do the TT vanish on the street all the time.

The secret is not in handling the TT, its in handling the SPECTATORS.
JamesinLA
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Hey, Zack. Happy New Year, etc.

Back to the original point. Which is using rings to draw your edge. You can do it. I've done it. It can work well. However, there is a risk. That is that people are able to watch the rings at a safe, half-interested and non committal distance. That, of coruse, it not where you want them. You want them close. If opening with the rings, you must then immediately draw them in close and tight right after the rings are done. These days, I usually start with close up coins and cards.

Jim
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Dave V
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Quote:
On 2005-01-01 20:48, Zack wrote:
Werner, its true that it is POSSIBLE to show your thumbs at all times, but then you're not doing the thumb tip are you? You're doing a dye tube.


Hypothetical question: If you do a dye tube style routine using a thumb tip, is it still considered a thumb tip?

Both Cellini and Phil Cass do TT routines that could pass for dye tube handling in places. I think wearing a TT to get into the routine and then finish it with a dye tube steal is the best of both worlds.

On the Rings:
According to his Street Magic book, Whit Hayden used to do a "Crash Link" with passers by. All he had to do was get someone's attention long enough to hand them one of the single rings. The noise and activity did the rest.

I agree though about it allowing them to watch from a safe distance. I think close up would be a better crowd starter to pull them in, then move up to Rings somewhere in the middle of your routine.
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Werner G. Seitz
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@BroDavid
You said it exactly...handlings like Cellini does use is what magic using a such tool is all about Smile

@Zack
Nope, I was talking about the TT and amongst other handlings about the same steal Cellini does use -which is credited to Slydini-, but an entirely diff. handling, because when watching Cellini you can 'se' the TT in place, at least at all the captures I have seen on DVD, but as BroDavid pointed out, the magic he creates makes this of no importance!
Being not near as good as Cellini, I prefer to play it safe and here the TT never is seen *in place*.

@Dave
IMHO, a TT is still a TT even when partly used as a Dye tube, as there is a bottom in a TT..and the handling I'm refering to, has similarities to using a dyetube on, or rather hold by thumbcroach/sometimes thumbtip, and middlefingertip.
There is a bit more to this, but watching f.ex. Salvano will open the eye of many users of the TT.

And..we're off topic re the original posting..I'll cut my postings off re the above now Smile
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Burnt
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Well I can't recomend any books but I would suggest maybe using the Ninja rings as they are smaller and also why not try and form them into some kind of different styled linking ring effect?
It's quite hard to get the same kind of stage routines to the street without having some chav demand looking at them.

I saw Fay Presto do a fantastic routine where she got the linking ring stuck to the microphone stand and then the whole routine was done while being attactched to the microphone. It was very funny and maybe you could try doing something similar to that only adapted to the street.
Wayne Hackler
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I'm going to also recommend Chris Capehart's three ring routine. He has graciously put it on DVD. It's available I believe only from Denny and Lee's. It's great and fast. I had the honor of learning some of the finer points from Chris this past September when he was in Madison, WI for the Houdini Club convention. He's a good teacher and a nice guy.
BroDavid
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I learned the Capehart routine from Chris Capehart (I just corrected this. I had previously mistyped, saying that Christ had taught me this, and while He has taught me a lot, it was not the rings.. Smile ) when he was at the Battle of Magicians in Canton Ohio a while back and I instantly bought the DVD from him and ran out and got lucky by getting a set of 3 RNT 10" rings cheap from a friend.

I also agree that he is a nice guy and a good teacher. Although some of the subtleties, like the invisible unlink are not covered very thoroughly on the DVD, but after a while, you just kind of "get it". I get more magicians ask me about the unlink than about the link Smile

Anyway, now that I am working on my cups and balls routines to close, I will start using the rings as my draw. The Capehart type ring routine is just way too much fun to put away simply because I am doing cups now.

BroDavid
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KirkG
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You have all heard the story about the comment made by a spectator to the magician, "Hey! I have a set of rings just like that at home, but they work differently."

This actually happened to me, twice!

I just performed the rings to a mixed audience of 6 months, to 70 plus years. All of them own TV's and not one of them came up and said there was a gap. Many came up to want to inspect the rings and many more came up and voice their amazment.

I think it comes down to how you handle the prop, whether a TT or LR's. If you move the same way as a beginner, you will be perceived to be using the same methods. You have gotten great tips here regarding the TT. It applies to the rings as well.

How many of you ham fistedly hold the key? There are many moves where it is held most openly. Do you always do the same or many repetitions of the same link? Do you always hold the key in one hand? These are many of the faults I see in linking ring performances.

That and performing them long before you are ready. It is not hard to link them together. It is hard to make it look effortless and magical. This is where the practice comes in.

Kirk G.
Kondini
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I was taught the rings by Ken Brooke,he was at least equal if not more advanced than anyone around today, that includes Cellini and Capehart, so I have no fear as to my own ability to sell the rings.
My beef comes from the fact that no matter how clever you are with them or a TT if the members of the audience are familiar with its exposure, like it or not,they are going to think that they know how you do it, this is a pre drawn conclusion on their part, and for a performer to work the illusion to these few skeptics would result in a hand washing, see I fooled you, episode which would clearly detract from ones performance. That's all.
KirkG
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Kondin,

You just need a ghost ring. Start with that and if the rest is casual and open you will slay them. No handwashing needed. Don't forget the final link where you unlink just two rings and immediately hand them to the spectator.

Kirk g
bropaul
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Don't worry... Be Happy... The jerks that are in the know will not hurt you during your ring routine. A few quick lines and they are gone, or just ignore them and they will fade away. I use the Whit Haydn routine and have done so since he taught it to me in the late 70's. GREAT routine. I used it for a closer for years and have moved it up to my second piece to get the crowd in close. It is about 8 to 9 minutes.

The best part is that it uses a spectator and I feel when you get someone up and they are handling and doing the magic it sucks them in. Plus people want to be close to the rings. So I serves me very well. I would like to more about Chris's routine and will search out the DVD. His name rings a bell from when I owned a magic shop in Tacoma, WA back in the mid 70's. I wonder...

In any case, use the rings. Find a routine that works for you and let the audience touch them. Whit told me to keep an extra single in the bag and place the "gaffed" set inside for a moment, switch the key out, and then take them back out and lay them down. If someone wants to see them after the show, just let them. They may even say, "I've got a set of these at home, but yours are different. Mine has a gap in one of the rings."

Good luck and continued success.
Bro. Paul West

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BroDavid
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Good advice on the switch bropaul, I picked that up on a table hopping rings tape (forget off hand whose tape it is, and will try to give credit when I find it) But he does the rings and then puts them away in his pouch/case, taking out a deck of cards (extra motivation for going to the bag, so putting the rings away, is kind of lost to the specs in the process)and he starts to do a card trick, and says, Oh, did you want to take a look at them? And he pulls out the three singles and allows everyone to checke them out.

I have been carrying a spare ring with me ever since, but never had a problem where I thought it would be useful yet.

As for Chris Capehart, I think he has a picture on his web site, http://www.chriscapehart.com. That might jog a mind view of him.

BroDavid
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kOnO
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Quote:
On 2005-01-13 10:46, BroDavid wrote:
Good advice on the switch bropaul, I picked that up on a table hopping rings tape (forget off hand whose tape it is, and will try to give credit when I find it) ...



I think that is the Michael Skinner tape on CLOSE UP LINKING RINGS...

kOnO
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BroDavid
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That is the one!

Thanks for the info transplant friend.

BroDavid
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Whit Haydn
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One of the reasons that I developed my four ring routine back in the 1960's was in order to be able to do a switch of the key. I found that working on the streets in NYC, after a show people would often ask to see the rings.

At the time I did both the Vernon six ring routine, and the Jack Miller five ring routine. I decided to put the rings into the bag while secretly switching the key for an extra single, and then leaving the rings (minus the key) sticking half way out of the bag. If someone asked to see them, I would just pull them out and hand it to them.

Unfortunately, no one could ever remember how many rings I had used, and they always wanted to know if that was "all of them" or if there were still more rings in the bag. That's when I decided to move to a four ring routine--two for me, two for the spectator. That way it was much easier for the spectators to remember how many rings were used, and when I did the exchange exactly the same way, I no longer got the request for the "other" rings.

It is important not to suggest that the spectators examine the rings, but to wait until asked. You hand them the rings with an indifferent shrug, and go on about your packing, etc. in a decidedly indifferent manner. This is what sells it.

The other good thing about the four ring routine, was that to me it seemed to make sense. If you could really do the magic of linking the rings, you would only really need two--pass them out, link them, pass them out again. That would be real magic.

By having two for me and two for the spectator asistant who I was "teaching," I was able to mimic the "real magic" scenario of using just two rings, and still have enough rings to do the switches, etc.

The idea for switching out the rings is very old, and several methods are in Fitzkee's book. Slydini did a switch, and I think Chung Ling Soo as well.
Bill Palmer
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Howard Hale has an interesting ring switch in his stage routine. I won't tip it. If you have seen his act, it has probably fooled you. But it is done completely on the off beat and very casually.

The key to the whole thing is indifference.

To paraphrase Sam Goldwyn, "Indifference is the most important thing -- once you can fake that, you've got it made."
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bropaul
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After reading what you pros are talking about maybe there is more to the switch than I know about. I just put the "set" in my right hand, put them in my bag, drop the key, pick up the ungaffed ring, pull them back out and lay them next to my bag on the street and move on with the show.

On the stage, I just put them away and have the extra ring next to the set. Seems that in the last 20 years, I've only had people want to "check out" the rings two or three dozen times and that's out of thousands of performances.

Seems like a mind set. If I don't care about the rings at the end and handle them in that way it is transmitted to the audience that there is no heat. Also the way the Haydn routine is structured with the spectator doing the work, and handling the rings, there really can't be a gaff, can there?

Thanks Whit for all the hats over the years. The checks in the mail.
Bro. Paul West

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Whit Haydn
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Quote:
On 2005-01-14 01:55, Bill Palmer wrote:

The key to the whole thing is indifference.

To paraphrase Sam Goldwyn, "Indifference is the most important thing -- once you can fake that, you've got it made."


Indifference is the secret key to the ancient Ninja art of invisibility. Smile

Don't "fake" what is so easy to "be" anyway.
Alan Munro
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Both Chris Capehart's and Whit Hadyn's routines will work on the streets very well. I lean a little toward Whit's routine, because the strategy in it is close to the routine that I use - a routine based on Harry Anderson's routine. If you hand the linked rings out to be examined, you just stopped exposure in it's tracks.

I remember right after the "masked moron" special, a little kid watching one of my shows said, "I know how that's done!", when I started into the Linking Ring routine. I handed the first linked set to him and thought, "Knock yourself out!" I know - I'm cruel. But it was fun when the kid thought he was going for the kill and began to realize that the masked guy played him for a sucker.
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