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W.F. Lewis Loyal user 225 Posts |
Okay,
I've heard the nam of the routine comes from the sound magicians would make as the items changed places. BUT...... I have also heard this called "chinese coin assembly".... Any correlation there? or am I overthinking this? I hope this post is not too politically incorrect.... Just inquiring... |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
The trick was first published in The Stars of Magic series which was collected and is still in print if you look for it.
David Roth found a way to do the trick with coins. Later, some political correctness concerns almost renamed the trick. It was NEVER considered a slur about or against Asians. Now about the "masterace" line in so many ace assemblies...
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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W.F. Lewis Loyal user 225 Posts |
HAHAHAHA!!!
"MASTERACE" that's awesome. Yeah, I've studied Malini-Bey Chink-a-Chink. Was just interested in the naming....... ....masterace........that is hilarious.. leave it to you mr. Townsend........I can't quit laughing!! |
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LordM Loyal user Portugal 232 Posts |
I Think that the original version of it doesen't uses coins.
It was one of my first magic tricks, a long long time ago whn I was 9. sniff.. |
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andre combrinck Special user South Africa 953 Posts |
It seems that this effect originated as a variation of Yank Hoe's 'Sympathetic Coins',using coins and cards/squares of paper.Someone then eliminated the use of cards to cover the coins.Since it was impossible to palm coins from a flat surface, sugar cudes,dice ect were used.David Roth then used a very clever idea(which was borrowed from Dereck Dingle),in the 70's to come up with Chink-a-Chink with coins.Michael Ammar has a variation called Shadow Coins.
Matrix effects look very magical. Andre |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-06-11 05:02, andre combrinck wrote: In order of assertions as written: 1) NO, the assembly predates the Yank Ho routine. 2) Someone? See if it was Mohammad Bey as written up in The Stars of Magic. 3) He did it with sugar cubes, see above. 4) The idea for sliding a coin around under the base of your thumb made it into print with Ross Bertram's coin assembly also in The Stars of Magic. 5) David did this before the Dingle Stuff was around and only Tony Slydini may have a claim on the "C" action David let loose in his 76 lecture. 6) Michael Ammar asked for and got permission from David to publish his on the floor and gaffed variation of the Roth routine. Not sure of the date there. I saw Kenner do the trick on the floor back in 87 (very well by the way). Word of the "on the floor" approach was around NYC by 78. Reading remains fundamental. Extra make-up points if you can find the first published use of the Bertram thing to clean up a trick. It's in an IBM magazine and the strategy had no name at the time as it was before the Roth lecture.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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andre combrinck Special user South Africa 953 Posts |
1.See David Roth's Expert Coin Magic p65.Quote:'The actual forerunner of all routines of this type is Yank Hoe's "Sympathetic Coins"...'.
2.Huh?In Stars of Magic it claims Malini made a huge impression on Bey with the said effect. 3.As did Malini by the sound of it. 4.Again see David's book, p66. Andre |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
Interesting about Maline and Bey on the chink-a-chink. Will have to check around on that. Any idea where Max got it? The earlierst source I have or an "assembly" goes back a ways to a cute trick with figurines.
Agreed about published "coin assemblies" Puzzled about the refernced to Dingle when the Bertram thing is there in SoM.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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Curtis Kam V.I.P. same as you, plus 3 and enough to make 3498 Posts |
Hopefully folks are still wondering about this...
Last night I "found" the effect weknow as "Chink-a-Chink" in Edwin Sachs' "Sleight-of-Hand". He calls it the "Japanese Sugar Trick" but it's clear from his description that the "Japanese" attribution is only so much rigamarole and claptrap. It's done in a square formation, with sugar cubes. A simple three step assembly in one corner, no extra "jumps". My copy is the Dover reprint of the 1885 second edition. It would be interesting to see if the trick is in the first edition, allowing us to place the dae still further back. Sachs does not claim it as his own, so the most we can say right now is that it was known as early as 1885, but Sachs did not call it "Chink-a-Chink". At any rate, this does predate Yank Hoe, I assume.
Is THAT a PALMS OF STEEL 5 Banner I see? YARRRRGH! Please visit The Magic Bakery
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markhammagi Regular user 135 Posts |
If I can make a comment related to the Bertram/Dingle question (#4). Richard Kaufman says that Roth was influenced by Dingle's "International Coins through the Table" routine which I assume is correct. However, Richard (in this one case) failed to mention that Dingle's ICTTT sliding move was based on Bertram's sliding move.
For those not aware, Dingle had an "informal" student of Ross Bertram when he lived in Canada in the sixtys (I have used the word "informal" since Bertram never took Dingle on as a student, but Bertram did provide Derek with a large amount guidance and instruction, whenever Derek asked for help). Dingle's sliding move can be found in two of Ross Bertram's routines - in "Coin Assembly" and "Rubdown" (Rubdown is of interest since it is the first example of using the sliding move to lap the coin). Both of these routines can be found in bound version of "Stars of Magic" as well as Ross Bertram's book "Magic and Methods". To get an idea of how much Bertram's coin assembly influenced Derek, all you need to do is take a look at Dingle's "Complete Works" book - the "Four-Way Backfire Coin Assembly" and the "Technical Variation of Bertram's Coin Assembly" are both technical variations on the Bertram routine. BTW, the sliding move is sometimes credited to Dr. Jacob Daley because of his routine "Motile" which appeared in The Phoenix #249 (and can also be found in Bruce Elliot's "The Classic Secrets of Magic", as well as Bobo). When initially published, Elliot mistakenly credited the move to Daley, but he later set the record straight, and confirmed that the sliding move was solely the creation of Ross Bertram.
Andy
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Curtis Kam V.I.P. same as you, plus 3 and enough to make 3498 Posts |
Andy, I don't recall the thumb base slide being used in the Bertram assembly. (I'm just running through the routine in my head) are you saying that the thumb base slide itself is in the assembly, or just the general concept of moving coins around by sliding them? In the assembly I recall, it's the move in Motile, that is, sliding the coin along with the backs of the fingers.
Is THAT a PALMS OF STEEL 5 Banner I see? YARRRRGH! Please visit The Magic Bakery
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Lawrence O Inner circle French Riviera 6811 Posts |
Rather than trying to tarnish the merits of David Roth, Derek Dingle, Yank Hoe or whoever, just for appearing well informed, it seems to me that there are several more interesting topics about Chink A Chink.
Just re-reading Sam Leo Horowitz on Malini's version in Stars of Magic, it dawned on me that most of us forget the initial part consisting in canceling out the use of an additional prop. The fifth cube is only collected secretly after proving that the performer is clearly using only four cubes. Malini would only get it after the presentation stage from under a napkin. With modern technique it could be secretly brought in with Slydini's Imp Pass and confirmed by performing Stanley Collins' Utility Move called Shuttle Pass where four props are displayed on the left palm (with one secretly palmed in the right hand) and three are transferred to the right over the palmed one for display on the right side under some pretense. In Pabular p 365, David Carre produces four dice before doing the routine Al Schneider's version should also be reminded for, too often, the light but quick style of David Roth is poorly imitated. Al's slow motion variant also introduces a secret undetectable hand change which deeply adds to the mystery. For my own variant a reversed T formation is used: initially there is only one sugar lump on the audience side and three on my side but at the end all four end up on the spectators' side. This is a very important psychological point (in my opinion) which already existed in the Malini routine but without explanation. Every effect where the props end up towards the audience, without mentioning if it's symbolically a present or an invitation to recheck everything, is perceived as a better effect (as opposed to effects where the props vanish creating a frustration) Now on the coin version, James Pradier in French Connection offers an invisible way of kicking the coin different from the thumb kick. Following the principle developed in the Sylvester the Jester (when people don't see the departure point, they don't see the travel happening n full view) this enlarges David Roth's thumb slide or Dean Dill pinky heel slide. This could be more positively considered by sleight of hand performer in search of direct and deceptive original moves. Blending techniques without making the routine less direct makes it even more magical Now it should be reminded that Max Malini, to make it a full routine was ending Chink A Chink with a two in the hand and one in the pocket before taking out and fistful of sugar lumps which was tossed on to the table. Since that time, some performers introduced the reverse matrix concept but none came with a direct method for changing four tabled copper coins into tabled silver coins at the end of a Chink A Chink routine. Anyhow, here is a bit of the work already supplied by performers without using any other cover than the hands. Ammar, Michael: Easy To Mater Money Miracles Vol 2. 1995. Shadow coins. The routine is very thorough letting the coins travel from outer left to inner right corner and then from inner right to inner left and then upper right before meeting one by one at the upper right corner (instead of the traditional matrix upper left). A presentation along the steps of Juan Tamariz’s magic way, discarding along the routine every possible solution. The extra coin is supplied by a shell and Michael offers a very nice clean up to re stack the shell at the end (a false turnover could be added for a version on a table). Two coins in each hand. Shelled coin on top of the two coins in right. Classic palm the shell. Have the coins examined. As coins are returned restack the shell rubbing the coins in the other hand to conceal the tiny noise. Table the two far coins (shelled coin on the far right slightly slightly closer to the inner right and left). Adjust the coins, stealing the shell as the coin out of line is adjusted. Pôl [Paul Asnar]. « Dé...routant ». Editions Cardini Club 1979. reproduced in Revue Magicus n° 117 2001. 5 pages and 26 figures describing this maginificent vertical Chink-a-Chink with four dice, placed behind cards. The dice magically meet behind one single card. Baumann, Fred: Apocalypse Vol 4 No 2 Feb 1981 p 450 In Hands Chink A Chink: in the spectator's hands! Bennett, Doug: Extra Sensory Deceptions. 27 pages, stapled booklet. Flash Light (chink-a-chink with flash cubes) Billis, Bernard. At a PGCDM, Bernard presented the Sands routine with buttons, the last one ending sewn on the silk. Buffaloe, Jim. Hippity Hop Half Modern Coin Magic by J.B. Bobo & Modern Coin Magic by Magic Makers. The concept is rarely used for chink a chink Carré, David. Pabular p. 365 Production of four dice and their use for a chink a chink. Colombini, Aldo. World's Greatest Magic – Matrix. Matrix / Chink-a-Chink. Conn, Doug. Tricks of My Trade - The Magic of Doug Conn; One of the most magical effects performable is "Chink-A-Chink." From Yank Hoe to Mohammed Bey to Albert Goshman, the genre has seen many variations. David Roth redefined "Chink-A-Chink" by stripping the props to their bare essentials - only four apparent coins and the performer's two hands. He titled his ground-breaking routine the more politically correct, "The Original Chinese Coin Assembly." Multiple variations of Roth's effect soon appeared, and they continue to do so - a testament to how wonderfully magical it is. Michael Ammar, Homer Liwag, Jason Alford, and Chad Long have all applied themselves to the genre (as have I). Doug's contribution to the assemblage is "Scramble." Doug has taken that venerable household item, the Scrabble™ tile, and applied its distinct properties to "The Original Chinese Coin Assembly." In fact, Doug employs both Roth's routine and Liwag's "Flash Rice" routine within "Scramble." Not only is Doug's routine magical, but it is one that will be talked about after your audience goes home - the familiar Scrabble™ tiles practically ensure this happenstance. In effect, the performer places four small, familiar-looking wooden tiles on the performing surface in a square formation. While waving his hands above the tiles, they jump around the performing surface as if they had life of their own, eventually collecting into one corner of the square formation. The magician turns the tiles over and their familiarity becomes apparent - Scrabble™ tiles! The four tiles show an E, an O, a G, and an N. The performer repeats the effect, this time with the letter sides of the tiles visible. As the tiles collect and jump around, they form different words that are in synch with the performer's patter. Finally, as the magician says, "Just say go, and they're GONE…" all four tiles jump to one corner and spell the word "gone!" You will need five Scrabble™ tiles: one G, two O's, one N, and one E. One of the O tiles should be a slightly darker shade than the other O tile. If you cannot find an O tile with a different shade, then you must mark one of the O tiles very slightly on the blank side so that you can distinguish it from the other tiles. The routine is best performed on a close up mat. Cros, Daniel. Las Vegas Close Up by Paul Harris p 87 Paper Chase. A paper napkin is torn in four pieces which are rolled up into four balls. After a chink a chink effect repeated three times, the last ball to travel is placed into the pocket and joins the other ones on to the table. Three of the balls are gathered under the finger of a spectator and the fourth is placed to the pocket. Upon lifting his finger and unravelling the napkin balls, the spectator finds that the fourth ball has wielded with the other three and that the napkin has restored. Cummins, Paul. Apocalypse Vol 10 # 9 Sept 1989 p 1405 Knich A Knich. Backfire chink a chink with Roth handling and special gimmick Diamond, Paul - Lessons in Magic - V3 - Mr Humble [VHS] & Videonics PROGRAM #77 Paul Diamond Vol. 3. Chink a Chink using plastic bottle caps Dill, Dean: Apocalypse Vol 15 No 1 Jan 1992 p 2023 : Coin Favorite: chink a chink routine using a shell & Apocalypse Vol 16 # 1 Jan 1993 p 2163: Swirl Assembly & Backfire: shadow coins using only coins, a mat and the hands & Apocalypse Vol 17 # 3 March 1994 p 2331: Coin Explosion "Gymnastics with coins"; chink-a-chink display, coins backfire and many coins appear & Extreme Dean Vol 2 No Extra’s uses four coins with Dean’s unique displacement and flick with the coin being dragged at the base of the pinky instead of the base of the thumb. Mixing Al Schneider and Dean Dill would be a killer. Just use the diamond formation or a reverse T formation. A multi coin variant of Jim Buffaloe’s Hippity Hop Half for the last coin could be a nice addition. Downs, Nelson. Is sometimes erroneously credited for having published the first chink a chink effect by Yank Hoe. The one published in his book is a matrix effect (coins under cards) and not a chink a chink effect (where only the hands are used as cover). Edwin Sachson the other hand describes in Sleight of hand p 40/41 a Chink a chink with sugar lumps and the book was published before 1875. For the record, Nelson Downs was born March 16, 1867. Eldin, Peter: The Magic Handbook.1985, Simon & Schuster, 189 pages, softcover. p 18 Chink a Chink: Matrix routine with sugar cubes covered by hands. Elliott, Bruce: Classic Secrets of Magic. 1953, llustrated by Stanley Jacks, Harper & Row - Galahad Books. p 93 Chapter 8: The Two Covers and the Four Objects: Chink A Chink type effects with Coins and Cards and another version with Magazines covering cards Farrell, Bob. The Art of Close Up Magic Vol 1 by Lewis Ganson p 333 Four Dice Chink-A-Chink: Dice and the dice pips transport one by one to the same corner Garcia, Daniel. Sh4de DVD. Daniel Garcia’s version without any extra coin or shell & The Daniel Garcia Project Vol 2 DVD Only Four is a brilliant only four coins Chink A Chink. Graham, John: Apocalypse Vol 20 No. 3 March 1997 p 2763: Effervescent: a Sympathetic Coins/Chink-A-Chink routine using 4 coins and expanded shell, with the handling to use a "Raven" style device to get rid of the shell Goshman Albert. Magic by Gosh. The life and times of Albert Goshman by Patrick Page 1985. "Chink-A-Chink". Four beer caps travel from hand to hand, a giant beer cap appearing at the end under the salt shaker. Translation in French by Alain Devals in La magie de Goshman, "Chink-a-Chink" p. 68 to 73 with 10 illustrations. Editions Guy Lore et Daniel Vuittenez, 1987 Gross, Henry: Pure Magic! A Primer in Sleight of Hand. p 191 The Four Paper Balls and Two Napkins: a Chink-a-Chink effect using paper balls and napkins Haydn, Whit: Chink A Chink (marketed effect) Whit has a nice gold miner story to justify the use of small weights one of them being nicely gaffed. Hoe, Yank. Conjuring with Coins by T. Nelson Downs. Sympathetic Coins & Greater Magic - A Practical Treatise On Modern Magic by John Northern Hilliard and Edited by Carl W. Jones and Jean Hugard p 689 The Sympathetic Coins (with Shell) and p 1223 A Brief Biography of Yank Hoe Kam, Kurtis: Kurtis Kam's Deceptions in Paradise Video. Chink A Chink & Professional Close-Up Magic of Curtis Kam by Magic Methods: Chink-A-Chink Kennedy, John: Lecture III (lecture notes, 1983). Translocation Klan, Rune. Three Pieces of Silver VHS 1997 Translated in French as Le voyage Sympathique » p. 4 and 5 of the Revue Imagik n° 17 october, no gimmick and ends clean. Korth, Jens. The Art Of Close Up Magic Vol 2 p 258 Roulette: A routine using poker chips and a roulette cloth. The chips vanish, penetrate, change places and colors. Uses a few gimmicked chips. Phased routine includes a penetration, a Chink-a-Chink sequence, flying counters, a color change, and a climax. Malini, Max. Malini-Bey Chink-a-Chink. Stars of Magic. Series 3, N° 3. 1947 -Tannen Publications. Four sugar lumps are placed in a square formation. The magician places his hands over two of the sugars. One by one the sugars meet at one of the points. Originally the routine became well known thanks to Max Malini but Mohamed Bey (Samuel Leo Horowitz, a genius) improved it mainly in avoiding the hands crossing. Malmros, Gert: Chink A Chink Coins. 8 page booklet (1980) by Gert Malmros from Sweden fully explaining his Chink A Chink four coin assembly Routine. This is a sit down routine at a table. The four coins are placed in four corners of the table and covered by the hands. One by one they travel across ending with all four coins under one hand. Marconick. Marconick’s Super Magic p 2 Les spheres nomades. The effect is performed with three balls (the fourth one being stolen as the third one is taken out from the pocket) Marlo, Edward: Apocalypse Vol 9 No 1 Jan 86 p 1159 Raised Assembly: a coin chink a chink using just the hands. Neighbors, David. David Neighbors on the double coin gimmick p 36: Succession Chink A Chink. Regal, David: Apocalypse Vol 13 No 1 Jan 1980 p 1736 The Coin Diamond: a quick backfire chink a chink with coins Rindfleisch, Joe. Extreme Coin Magic DVD Matrixy. No extra coin is used. An actual improvement on David Roth’s Chink A Chink and Michael Ammar’s Shadow coins. During the setting up his idea to arrange the visible coins with the dirty hand is nice but the performer should give some movement to the right hand as well. High Rise Matrix is a superb idea of palming a piece of flesh colour clay to gain depth in the coin picking. It achieves something like the Charlie Frye’s matrix with dice: the height of the hand above the travelling object destroys any suspicion of palming (the hand doesn’t even touches the coin). In Joe’s routine the absence of cards supplies an even greater deception than in Charlie Frye’s effect. This is a really great gimmick and Joe supplies a smart idea to disengage it at the proper moment. If performing standing Bob Kohler's Cool Clean Up works with the gimmick on. Rink (Aka J. Van Rinkhuyzen). The Art of Close Up Magic Vol 2. p 112 Chink A Chink Simplified: Chink-a-Chink using any small lightweight objects and a tiny bit of double sticky tape Rosenthal, Harvey: Perfect Coin Assembly New Stars of Magic. Volume 1, Number 5. Tannen Publications - 1973, 7 pages and 42 figures. Four coins are placed at the four corners of a silk. The corners of the silk are folded over each of the coins concealing them from view. They all meet at the upper left corner. Each travel is more difficult to understand than the previous one. The last travel is made under impossible conditions. Roth, David: A Lecture by David Roth. 1977, Chinese coin assembly & Same routine in Apocalypse, Vol 1, N° 1, 1978, an additional coin is used and the hand cross during the routine & Ultra coin assembly. Coin Magic by Richard Kaufmann - 1981. p 51: the hands no longer cross and an additional coin is used & Chinese coin assembly. Expert Coin Magic & Chink A Chink. Ultimate Coin Manipulation Collection & New York Coin Magic Seminar Vol One Coins Across. Chink A Chink. David has very unique circular movement to bring the coin at the bas of the thumb when it still seems at the fingertips. Sachs, Edwin: Sleight of hand p 40/41 describes Chink a chink with sugar lumps (since the book was published before 1875, it cannot be claimed that Max Malini, born in 1873, was the inventor of the trick. Sands, George & Van Slyker. The Tarbell Course in Magic Vol. 6 by Harlan Tarbell, 1954 p. 148-152. Birds of a Feather. This “New version” uses only four coins and a handkerchief by folding its corners over the coins. Schneider, Al. the Al Schneider Technique Vol 1 Chink a Chink. With the pause as an old Buddhist Monk: The routine illustrates the importance of devoting some time after the revelation of the result*** Schulien, Matt. The Magic of Matt Schulien by Philip Reed Willmarth - 1959. The Cards and the Cigarette; p. 100 to 106. A borrowed cigarette is broken into four pieces. After traveling under a card, the cigarette is restored and handed back to the owner of the cigarette. The pieces are ditched under the table. Stone, David. La Magie des pieces Cocktail Matrix is a standing version of chink a chink with four silver and a penny using an extra coin (a double facer) as misdirection. Placing the last move in the spectator’s hand is interesting. & Made In France Lecture Notes: written description of Cocktail Matrix. Thompson, John: Polished Polish Prestidigitation. Jeff Busby 1981. p 29 Chink-A-Chink: John Thompson's superb handling of the original Max Malini routine. Commercial Classics of Magic DVD: Chink a Chink with EL variant of sliding the lumps (not credited) but I taught it to him when he came to Paris for my birthday and he taught me the one I’m using now, having only added the Charlie Miller - Scott York Diamond formation. Watkins, Dan. Caplocation This e-Book with e-film performance offers an evolution of John Kennedy’s Translocaton effect. 1. No gaffed coins are used (Bottle caps are used). 2. It utilizes very easy to acquire, cheap “throw away” props. 3. Obvious and immediate application to restaurant/bar magicians. 4. No sliding coins (or caps): The hands cover the caps, and simply move away. The performer can literally step back from the table and allow the audience to take in the miracle if he desires. There is no need to have a soft surface to perform on. Williamson, David. Floating Assembly. Williamson Wonders by Richard Kaufman. 1989. The routine uses only four coins and four cards which seem never to touch the cards. Richard Kaufman’s text is translated in French by Jean-Jacques Sanvert as « Les Merveilles de Williamson » par. Ed. Mayette Magie Moderne - 1994. p. 44 46 Assemblée Flottante. York, Scott. Scott York Lecture Magic Castle. page 41 Another Perspective on Chink-A-Chink. Using beer caps the routine brings in the Diamond formation created by Charlie Miller. Translation in French by Jean-Pierre Meunier, p. 18-19 de la Revue Arcane n° 45 de janvier 1987
Magic is the art of emotionally sharing live impossible situations
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CAPTAIN BEYOND New user Beloit,Wisconsin 60 Posts |
A friend of mine showed me chink-a-chink using beer bottle caps.Works great,all I use now.
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Merc Man Inner circle NUNEATON, Warwickshire 2537 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-02-01 20:42, CAPTAIN BEYOND wrote: Al Goshman also used these BUT with an excellent finale - a massive bottle cap making its appearance..........under the salt shaker (where else)!
Barry Allen
Over 14 years have passed - and still missing Abra Magazine arriving every Saturday morning. |
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fortasse Inner circle 1201 Posts |
Cap-location by Dan Watkins (who posts here) is a good C-a-C version with bottle caps too. Unusual layout and sneaky routine. Can order it online. Well worth the price.
Fortasse |
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R.E. Byrnes Inner circle 1206 Posts |
I believe 'chink' is no longer the preferred nomenclature -- though I do perform it in my Oriental Routine
Posted: Mar 19, 2011 5:38pm I call it "origami," by the way |
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Lawrence O Inner circle French Riviera 6811 Posts |
You may have a hard time to get another name than Chink A Chink adopted by the community.
Magic is the art of emotionally sharing live impossible situations
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TAJ Regular user 197 Posts |
Here is a video of Fred Kaps performing the routine: http://youtu.be/bu476AyQyj4
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juggle New user 84 Posts |
What the best chink-a-chink set (with a sh*ll) that is being sold currently?
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Jim Sparx Inner circle Far Out, Texas 1144 Posts |
In regards to the name, we don't usually tell the audience members the name of the trick and it is done with objects such as coins, sugar cubes, etc. not in reference to persons to Asian descent. However, I am unaware of the original patter for this trick and if the terms Chink were in reference to people it would be demeaning in my view.
Magic catalogs from the early 1900s were full of gags and stunts with pictures and words that were racially motivated and unacceptable today, thankfully.
Et tu, Spartacus?
https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/chispadeelpaso.html |
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